Forty-two years ago, critic Roger Ebert said that because heroes and gimmicks tend to repeat from production to production, “Each film is only as good as its villain.”
To deepen our understanding of the complex nuances that antagonists bring to their stories, let’s take a look at a recent online discussion. It started when Reddit userCynicalCosmologistmade aposton the platform, asking everyone “What movie is really sad when told from the ‘villain’s’ perspective?”
Image credits:CynicalCosmologist
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Man, the Grinch just wanted to hang out with his dog on the mountain, and asked his stupid neighbors to shut up.
We managed to get in touch with the author of the now-viral post and they kindly agreed to have a little chat with us about it.“I was talking to a friend from work about this subject, and he said how so many examples that fit the subject of a sad backstory are simply born into a world of brutality,” CynicalCosmologist said, describing the origins of the post toBored Panda.“One commonality of many movie villains is based on the natural world, where these villains are simply carnivores who have to hunt, kill, and destroy in order to survive. This is what made me add my comment on the T-Rex from The Land Before Time; he is fundamentally just a famished creature who has to go to great lengths simply to survive at a time of ecological disaster.”
We managed to get in touch with the author of the now-viral post and they kindly agreed to have a little chat with us about it.
“I was talking to a friend from work about this subject, and he said how so many examples that fit the subject of a sad backstory are simply born into a world of brutality,” CynicalCosmologist said, describing the origins of the post toBored Panda.
“One commonality of many movie villains is based on the natural world, where these villains are simply carnivores who have to hunt, kill, and destroy in order to survive. This is what made me add my comment on the T-Rex from The Land Before Time; he is fundamentally just a famished creature who has to go to great lengths simply to survive at a time of ecological disaster.”
Jaws. Bruce is just trying to be a shark, man.UrbanGimli:THESE SHARK INFESTED WATERS!!!!!you mean their home?KILL THE MONSTER!!SpookyYurt:The phrase ‘shark-infested waters’ drives me nuts. Are our living rooms human-infested?? No. That’s just where people live. Sharks don’t ‘infest’ the ocean, that’s where they belong.
Ok, hear me out: Richard from Crocodile Dundee. You’re Richard, Sue’s boyfriend and boss (ok, off to a great start…). Your girlfriend Sue INSISTS on doing a human interest piece on some dude. You’re like, “come home I miss you”, and she’s like “just this one more story”, and you’re like “ok, you’re the best.” So she goes off to find Michael J “Crocodile” Dundee. Within 48 hours of meeting Mick, she’s making out with him. You, Richard, have no idea…but it’s gotta be suspicious that she BEGS to bring him back to NYC. It’s IMMEDIATELY apparent what’s going on. Sue is basically drooling over Mick, she’s parading him around the upper crust of New York society, they’re having some moments. She even f*****g invites him to the first date the two of you have had since she got back. You’re understandably salty about this…and you get punched out for it. Feeling desperate to save your relationship, you throw a Hail Mary. While visiting her family - which you’re on GREAT terms with - you propose. She says yes! Crisis averted…until the NEXT DAY when she takes it back and chases Mick into the subway to tell him she loves him. It’s been like a week since the two of them met. And you know the worst part? You, Richard, paid for all of this to happen: this whole thing went down on the newspaper’s dime. And the second worst part? You’re still Sue’s boss. You’ll be seeing her at the office on Monday. You have less than 24 hours to pull yourself together. Richard got cheated on, villainized, and broken up with in the coldest way…and his only crime was not being happy about it. He’s not the bad guy in this story. Sue is the bad guy in Crocodile Dundee. Thank you for attending my TED talk.
Other commonalities that CynicalCosmologist has noticed are personal tragedy and trauma. “Villains such as Two-Face in The Dark Knight, or Tai Lung in Kung Fu Panda, lost everything that they cared about, and their lifelong dreams were destroyed, due to matters that were beyond their control. Similarly, we have villains who only want to protect those they care about from some greater threat, which, for example, applies to Magneto (X-Men) and V (V for Vendetta).“The Redditor thinks that because of the way these characters are portrayed in film, it’s difficult not to see them as “hate-fueled, remorseless monsters.““If we ever found ourselves in their shoes, however, we would understand the terrible trauma which many of these ‘villains’ have endured, and I think it’s important to recognize this as a driver for their actions, as a human trait,” they added.
Other commonalities that CynicalCosmologist has noticed are personal tragedy and trauma. “Villains such as Two-Face in The Dark Knight, or Tai Lung in Kung Fu Panda, lost everything that they cared about, and their lifelong dreams were destroyed, due to matters that were beyond their control. Similarly, we have villains who only want to protect those they care about from some greater threat, which, for example, applies to Magneto (X-Men) and V (V for Vendetta).”
The Redditor thinks that because of the way these characters are portrayed in film, it’s difficult not to see them as “hate-fueled, remorseless monsters.”
“If we ever found ourselves in their shoes, however, we would understand the terrible trauma which many of these ‘villains’ have endured, and I think it’s important to recognize this as a driver for their actions, as a human trait,” they added.
Squidward from SpongeBob SquarePants. All he wants is some peace and quiet.circa285:You know you’re a fully developed adult when you start to find SpongeBob really annoying and identify with Squidward’s point of view.
We Bought a Zoo - I mean damn, the ‘villain’ literally is a safety inspector and is doing a public service making sure the dangerous animals you’re keeping for public display are safe, secure and not mistreated.
Storytellers know this and, especially those who are good at their craft, understand their antagonists. George Langelaan, who penned The Fly, a cult classic sci-fi/horror short story about a research scientist turning into a huge monstrous fly, said in a January 1961 issue of Suspense magazine, “As a writer I take such a liking to villains that I try to give them a jolly good time and, in the end, to let them off as lightly as possible.“He even proposed creating The Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Villains.
Storytellers know this and, especially those who are good at their craft, understand their antagonists. George Langelaan, who penned The Fly, a cult classic sci-fi/horror short story about a research scientist turning into a huge monstrous fly, said in a January 1961 issue of Suspense magazine, “As a writer I take such a liking to villains that I try to give them a jolly good time and, in the end, to let them off as lightly as possible.”
He even proposed creating The Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Villains.
X-Men. Magneto was right and his backstory was very sad.
Tom and Jerry. They’re secretly friends, but Tom has to hunt him and “fail” every time. One episode the homeowners wanted to swap Tom for a cat who actually would kill Jerry, but Tom tried to stop that.
This can teach us a lot about empathy. “If we extend this logic to the real world, we see how many people who landed themselves in jail have only committed their crimes out of fear, trauma, and desperation,” CynicalCosmologist continued. “Sure, there are fictional and real-life villains who are psychopaths, and have no remorse at all for their actions, but many of them have much more troubled histories.““A movie can paint a very vivid picture of what they have been through, and it can help people understand what led people down such dark paths, and hopefully get them to rehabilitate. That’s why I think this discussion topic is a powerful and meaningful one; it can help make recovery much more humane and effective for many.”
This can teach us a lot about empathy. “If we extend this logic to the real world, we see how many people who landed themselves in jail have only committed their crimes out of fear, trauma, and desperation,” CynicalCosmologist continued. “Sure, there are fictional and real-life villains who are psychopaths, and have no remorse at all for their actions, but many of them have much more troubled histories.”
“A movie can paint a very vivid picture of what they have been through, and it can help people understand what led people down such dark paths, and hopefully get them to rehabilitate. That’s why I think this discussion topic is a powerful and meaningful one; it can help make recovery much more humane and effective for many.”
I recently re-watched The Little Mermaid and, well, let’s just say I was rooting for her father rather than the 16yo wanting elope with a person she saw for like a minute. That said, Triton doesn’t really handle the situation well.Deep-Jello0420:Ariel: ‘I’m 16! I’m not a child anymore!‘7-year-old Me: ‘Yeah! She’s basically a grown up! Don’t be mean, Triton!‘41-year-old Me: ‘She is absolutely a child and I wonder if my parents thought that line was as ridiculous as I find it now when we watched it 30+ years ago’.space_pumpkin:‘bUt DaDdY I LoVe HiM!’ Sh*t makes me cringe now every time.
Thor 1. Loki loses everything, finds out his whole life is a lie, even his skin is a lie, the people who he was supposed to trust the most (his parents) betrayed him about who he was and brought him up in a society that thought his real race were disgusting savage monsters to the point that he thought it was ok to try and kill them all, and in the middle of having a mental break down his dad goes into a coma while his mom is emotionally unavailable to give him any support because she’s busy watching the dad, and his friends betray him to go help his brother on earth, so he is completely isolated with no support system undergoing the worst crisis of his life and goes off the rails, to the point of committing suicide because he realized no matter what he did he could never gain the approval of his father or belong there as the only frost giant in all of Asgard.It’s an epic tragedy when you look at it from his perspective.
The Redditor has taken notice of many cool movie villains over the years. “I am a lifelong Star Wars fan, and Palpatine has consistently had me on the edge of my seat,” they said.
“Sure, the plot developments of each era of the franchise have sparked a lot of controversies amongst the fans, but Palpatine was the mastermind behind the entire conflict from day one. He manipulated and murdered the people closest to him to rise through the ranks of the Sith order, the Galactic Republic, and the absolute control of the galaxy.”
Sound of Music – not the N*zis obviously, but the baroness. Imagine you’re a wealthy, savvy, child free woman open minded enough to date a sulking widower with a billion children he ignores in favor of travel and partying– in other words, your lifestyle. You’re not into kids but you try to be a presence in their lives when he finally deigns to introduce you to them (same time he announces that he’s marrying you, so he’s a super great father). You put on a cheerful face anyway, and when it’s apparent the kids hate you (you are a stranger after all!), you consider sending them to boarding school where they might benefit from, say, structure and attention and schooling that they are not getting at home from their father/endless rotating nannies. Then the super virginal, younger au pair moves in, and your boyfriend suddenly decides he is totally into being father of the year again after his Austrian rumspringa, and dumps you.
Lion King. I’m not saying Scar was right for killing his brother and running the Pride Lands into the ground, but they call him Scar because he had a physical deformity. Before he was nicknamed Scar, his parents named him Takka… Which means garbage. “Oh hi. Let me introduce you to my sons ‘King’ and ‘Garbage’” How is that not setting your youngest up for failure?
As their thoughts on Palpatine suggest, the Redditor believes the “perfect” villain is one who has a grand, thorough scheme for everything. “They consider every possibility before making their next move. An ingenious villain with an ingenious scheme leaves the viewer constantly guessing where the plot of the movie (or franchise) is going to lead; or retrospectively, piecing together the story so far and predicting the outcome.“This is why CynicalCosmologist has thoroughly enjoyed movies with enigmatic puzzles like Glass Onion, or mind-bending twists like The Usual Suspects, and we can only agree that meticulously crafted villains not only enhance the suspense but also contribute to the overall depth and richness of the story.
As their thoughts on Palpatine suggest, the Redditor believes the “perfect” villain is one who has a grand, thorough scheme for everything. “They consider every possibility before making their next move. An ingenious villain with an ingenious scheme leaves the viewer constantly guessing where the plot of the movie (or franchise) is going to lead; or retrospectively, piecing together the story so far and predicting the outcome.”
This is why CynicalCosmologist has thoroughly enjoyed movies with enigmatic puzzles like Glass Onion, or mind-bending twists like The Usual Suspects, and we can only agree that meticulously crafted villains not only enhance the suspense but also contribute to the overall depth and richness of the story.
TitanicImagine you are just chilling in the ocean and a big boat comes and hit you and the boat gets all the attention.
Yeah, I gotta say that ‘Despicable Me’ hit me right in the feels when you saw how Gru went from stealing an entire moon to being a dad. Who knew little yellow minions could make such an impact? Overall, 10/10 would ugly cry again.
The hyenas in the Lion King were banished to an elephant graveyard and were hungry. It’s not like the lions weren’t killing things to eat themselves, but Mufasa wasn’t going to let hyenas get away with that.Of course they’re going to follow the guy who promises them food. Their part in Be Prepared is “we’re going to be able to eat!” And then when they do get to leave the graveyard they overdo it because they’d never been allowed to eat anything but elephants who came to die, which probably isn’t an everyday occurrence.
Bee Movie 😂 A bee stole this man’s girlfriend.RVelts:It’s a wild ride. I shrugged it off years ago as just being some kid’s movie Jerry Seinfeld felt like making. I didn’t realize how insane the plot is… the courtroom scenes, the romance, the wild ending, the snipers…DNP96:This man is losing his wife to a literal bee and everyone thinks he’s crazy.
Encanto.Family obsessed with ‘keeping up appearances’ shun Bruno for simply telling the truth, that people naturally don’t like to hear. Ends up being demonised and alone while the head narc and family lie and blame him for their failings and bad experiences.
Star Trek II: The Wrath of KhanDude is allowed to live in peace and rule an untamed planet instead of going to prison. He’s living his best life.His planet gets turned into a barren wasteland, wife and some family members die, and some get a nasty case of earworms. All because some toupee-wearing space douchbag never bothered to occassionally check up on them.
Meet the Robinsons.Agreeable_Oil_936:Goob just needed some sleep is all.Geminii27:I can understand that. I’ve shouted at people who wouldn’t let me sleep, before.
Austin Powers. Dr Evil’s upbringing is tragic: The details of my life are quite inconsequential…. My father was a relentlessly self-improving boulangerie owner from Belgium with low-grade narcolepsy and a penchant for buggery. My mother was a 15-year-old French prostitute named Chloé with webbed feet. My father would womanize; he would drink; he would make outrageous claims like he invented the question mark. Sometimes, he would accuse chestnuts of being lazy, the sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament.gardenfella:My childhood was typical: summers in Rangoon… luge lessons… In the spring, we’d make meat helmets… When I was insolent I was placed in a burlap bag and beaten with reeds—pretty standard, really. At the age of 12, I received my first scribe. At the age of 14, a Zoroastrian named Vilmer ritualistically shaved my testicles. There really is nothing like a shorn scrotum—it’s breathtaking… I suggest you try it.
Pirates of the Caribbean. This pirate crew found treasure, it was cursed. They became undead, feeling nothing, tasting nothing. A shadow of their former selves. For some reason, everyone was trying to stop them becoming mortal even though it would be easier for all parties to help them restore the treasure.Also as most pirates are on the ship when the curse is lifted, they surrendered to the Royal Navy. They were all undoubtably hung immediately after the credits role.
Les Miserables. Javert was born inside a jail and we see repeatedly how unforgiving Paris is to children without a support system and the destitute. He miraculously manages to works his way from that to a respectable middle-class job. And that’s before Jean Valjean shows up and becomes the greatest failure of his career eventually driving him to s*icide.
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Mr.Freeze- Batman Animated Series. It won awards I think.BrokenWalkmanBelt:Most of the villains, really. BTAS did a great job at humanizing Batman’s villains. Mr Freeze just wanted to save his wife, Harvey Dent thought he put a kid in the hospital (but it turns out he was just in there for appendicitis) and it stuck with him his whole life and messed him up mentally, Clayface had his face mangled in an accident and was promised a miracle cure in exchange for a few favors. I could go on and on.And if you break into the comics, we can add Joker to this list. The Killing Joke is phenomenal and Joker had a great point that all it really takes is one bad day to break someone.
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General Francis X. Hummel from The Rock. Joins the military at a young age and believes that he’s fighting for his country and commands several special clandestine operations for the government and his men get killed. Because they were black ops, the US government doesn’t give their families any benefits, it doesn’t recognize them as having even served, and they don’t even get military funerals. Hummel pleads with the Government to recognize these men and that they fought and died to further America’s interests and he even goes before Congress to ask for the funds. They tell him to kick rocks. When his wife dies, he’s had enough and feels he has to force their hand through taking hostages and threatening to launch VX poison gas rockets at population centers. He has no intent to go along with this plot, it’s just a bluff.
Principal Rooney in Ferris Bueller’s Day OffHe’s a (relatively) low-paid administrator who has to run this large high school of privileged white kids who think they’re above everyone and know they can get away with terrible behavior. He’s just doing his job of keeping kids accountable and in school, and this particular kid is just the worst. Rooney’s got a building full of this type of kid and it’s a gargantuan task to deal with that daily and not sink into a bottle every night.
I can’t believe no one has mentioned the Thing from The Thing. Poor thing crashed on a hostile planet and was just trying to survive. Humans came along and burned him and blew him up.Poor thing.
Gollums I feel like. It’s debatable if he’s a villain or not, I always felt sad for that greasy cave dweller.
Blade Runner. And it works either way, if you see Batty as the villain or Deckard.
Godzilla. Especially in Son of Godzilla. Godzilla just wants to be, man. Every time he shows up people start shooting at him. That would p**s anyone off, and destroying cities is a good way to nonverbally say stop pissing me off.And as demonstrated in Son of Godzilla, he has emotions and cares for his son. And his son saves a human out of affection for her as well. These are thinking, feeling beings. And if humans would think how to befriend the Kaiju rather than destroy them we could have solid allies.Mothra is a prime example of this. He protects an entire village in exchange for their reverence. Pretty sweet deal.
Koba in Planet of the Apes. All he has been exposed to is cruelty and the worst of humanity. Then Caesar tells him he has to forgive humans and let them work on the dam. When someone has been abused and broken that badly, then told they have to ally and work with their abusers. It’s no wonder he snapped. The book between rise and dawn goes into a lot more detail such as his trainer got drunk one day slashed up koba’s face and then used a cigarette to blind him.
Sleepless In SeattleWalter (Bill Pullman). The guy is engaged to a woman he’s totally into. He does cute s**t for her and has plans with her for the future (beyond, you know, getting married). She acts super flighty and is pretty dismissive of him. He’s understanding and kind. Then she abandons him to fly across the country to meet a guy she heard on a radio show and calls off the wedding to be with radio show guy.That’ll do a number on anyone’s psyche.Edit: Walter is not really a villain, per say. It’s a romcom. But he is the antagonist to Tom Hanks’ character.
The bad people in Us just want to live on the surface. :(
While robbing a house is of course is bad, but the two robbers were brutally attacked and nearly killed (some of the traps at least would have killed them in real life). Home Alone.
Phantom of the Opera.PerfumedP*rnoVampire:Idk Erik was pretty creepy and essentially groomed a young girl, but I guess it makes sense when you consider he probably had underlying mental illness on top of being socially ostracized for his appearance all his life.
The Terminator. AI tries to rid the world of a cancerous parasite, which ultimate destroys it. It even tries to go back in time to win, only to find it’s avatar in a closed time loop that created the conditions that led to it’s destruction.Sad!
Aladdin is the story of a royal Vizier who worked his way to the top, and needs to manage a clearly incompetent Sultan and a Princess whose idea of diplomacy is to sic her tiger on foreign dignitaries.In desperation he turns to magical aid, but the thief he employed to steal the lamp decides to use that magic to seize power for himself, despite also having no idea how to administer a kingdom or conduct diplomacy.
Cal from Titanic.He brought his fiancé on this brand new luxurious ship to take them to the U.S. to get married. Then she definately has an affair with this poor guy she’s never met, and decides to stay on the sinking ship with said poor guy.And Cal almost DIES on the ship himself, as he was in a collapsible lifeboat that was partially flooded. Irl, this caused those in that lifeboat to have serious damage to their legs.So after this seriously traumatic night, what does our “villan” do? He looks for his fiancé that realistically should be dead, and he assumes her to be dead. Everyone does. Then he kills himself after the stock market crash of 1929.Was Cal an angel? No. But he didn’t cheat, unlike Rose.
Gothel in Tangled.Reclusive woman finds a magical flower growing in the woods. It becomes her only friend, to the point that she sings to it to help it grow. But then it reveals a secret: it has magical healing abilities which come out through the power of song.Because she knows anyone else who finds the flower will try to dig it up and take it for themselves, using the immortality the flower gave her, she dedicates her life to protecting the flower.Then, one day the super rich and powerful king sends someone to follow her to discover her secret. He orders his men to dig up the flower so it can be used to save his wife and no one else. Then, instead of replanting it so it will maintain its power, he cuts it and FEEDS IT TO HIS WIFE.Gothel devolves into a grief spiral because she failed to protect the flower, then becomes a villain obsessed with retrieving the flower and protecting it for all eternity.
Like, OMG, there was this totally sad story from way back, like, in the ancient days of summer camp vibes. So, Jason, he was, like, a bit slow in the brain, you know? But he had this total dream of finding pals and stuff, even though everyone treated him like he was, like, the ultimate uncool outcast.So, Jason decides to hit up this camp, thinking maybe he can catch some good vibes and stuff. But, like, his dreams got totally crushed when a bunch of kids dissed his splash at the lake. Rude much?Anyways, Jason, in his cute goggles, was just trying to be his fab self, swimming around, on the lookout for some underwater fishy friends. Little did he know, there were these two camp counselors sneaking off to a shed for, like, some sneaky adult playtime. So not profesh!In a major bummer twist, Jason gets this mega cramp in his tummy. He’s, like, screaming for help, but no one hears him. Especially not those two counselors busy doing who knows what in the shed. Ugh, the worst!And, you know, the poor dude drowns, and his bod isn’t even found. Talk about a total downer for Jason Voorhees. Like, hello, world, can’t we be a little less harsh? Total sadness, I can’t even.
Little Mermaid. Ursula was banished for being unattractive, old, and over weight.
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